September 3, 2004
Photoblogger Conclusion (Day 5)
Praise the Lord, the end has come. The convention is over, and all the rabble-rousing photobloggers have returned to their spider holes in Brooklyn and Lower Manhattan. There was some action yesterday around Union Square and MSG, and just for old times sakes, we're going to post some links. We'll add anything that comes in, so check this post a few times over the next couple of hours, days, and weeks. Thanks to all the great photographers who shot the convention. Now we're going back to bed. [Also check out: Days 0, 1, 2, 3, and 4.]
- The NYC Indymedia site scoops the world with the first pictures from inside the NYPD Guananamo detention center on the West Side highway. Bravo! [the picture above is from their site]
- Mike was up at Union Square for the candlelight vigil
- Keith extends his great RNC coverage with two posts from the ANSWER protest
- We bumped into the very cute Youngna yesterday as she was shooting around Union Square
- State of the Art has 99 assorted RNC photos in a gallery
- ScaryNY was also up at the ANSWER protest and took some pix
- Many Highways was up at Union Square and also up by the Garden
- Paul Ford has some pictures and commentary from an RBR (Republican Boat Ride)
- Rion was also at the Candlelight Vigil at Union Square
- Keith is posting some really nice highlights at Overshadowed
- Ixtayul gets the scene around the Garden on Thursday Night
- Joe captures some strangely attractive rabble rousers
- Grumpy Monk has some great pictures from the last week- start here and move backwards
- Brooklynvegan was at the Candlelight Vigil in Brooklyn
- Bluejake was out and about with the protestors down by Union Square
- An amazing QRVR three dimensional image of the Axis of Eve panty demo from Jim Galvin
- Pretty good BFB gallery over at Indymedia
- Khoi shows us the Bush Must Go signs around Cornell
- Bluejake goes back to Union Square and adds some commentary, and quotes Bright Eyes
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Here's three from for the dead yesterday at Union Square.
http://www.grumpymonk.com/archives/2004/09/every_night_uni.html
http://www.grumpymonk.com/archives/2004/09/memorial_union.html
http://www.grumpymonk.com/archives/2004/09/veteran_nun_uni.html
I realise that the site is about New York, but as possibly 100's of Russian school children lie dead after a day's fighting between Russian security services and hostage takers does it really matter what the hell happened at RNC 2004? Another point, is there any real concern for the fact that some people have been in the real Guantanamo for years now with no charges and seemingly no hope of a release. A few New Yorkers get thrown in a the slammer and all hell breaks loose. I guess human rights only matter when 'you' loose them.
Candlelight vigil in Brooklyn:
http://www.brooklynvegan.com/archives/2004/09/brooklyn_democr_1.html
as you said Sean, this site is about NYC. but good points especially conisdering the Guantanamo detainees have been sitting there without representation under the watchful eye of one George W. Bush.
would highly recommend the pics from rion. Good example of what NYC is -- young and old of all races and religions. I love this city!
hey, just because Guantanamo is happening doesn't make the indiscriminate and preventive detentions in addition to illegally long detentions in NYC during the RNC ok.
Hitler gassed millions, so if we start to publicly flog protestors, that should be ok?
In china you can't view what you want on the internet and pro democracy citizens are locked up, so if Homeland security wants to read my email and see what books i check out at the library I should just be happy that I live here in this great free country? That makes NO sense? Actual FREEDOM makes us free, not just freedom in theory.
Saddam tortured thousands and killed hundereds at abu grahb, so those tortured by americans there should just be thankful that most of them are alive to tell the tale and that their physical wounds will mostly heal? The state taking away a person's liberty for even a minute without just cause and then not releasing that person in the time period the law requires is a HUGE deal anywhere, and in America, the land of the free, we should be outraged. I am not willing to let anyone's rights be trampled on here in the US just because someone somewhere is in an even worse situation. Ever heard of the slippery slope? WE are all standing on it right now.
Don't get me wrong on this. I love the site and love NY. There is a similar site planned for London, I hope it'll be as good. Remember that most of those in detention in Guantanamo are not American citizens and so do not enjoy the rights accorded you in your Bill of Rights. The point I was tryig to make was one of degrees of importance thats all. I'll check out the pics later.
Were there that many police in Boston for the DNC?
Sean, the point is that the city was ignoring the Constitution and state laws to lock up protestors until the convention was over. The city refused to explain what was taking so long, and held protestors way over legal limits. The State Court of Appeals ruled in 1991 that anyone arrested in New York who is not arraigned within 24 hours is eligible for immediate release. They released robbers before they got around to protestors.
I think what Sean is pointing out is that in the big picture, the complaints of "Guantanamo on the Hudson" are ultimately making a mountain out of a molehill. New Yorkers are caring about it because it happened here. But all things considered there were many sucessful protests. Including the incredible fact that despite increased security, protestors snuck in. And despite the supposedly bad treatment of cops, no real bloodshed and riots happened.
Yes, it might not have been pleasant to be detained. And it's not pleasant to be in prison conditions. But you know what? Think about what happened here in NYC compared to other protests elsewhere and this was actually quite successful on both sides. And messages were sent.
All things considered I think the protests were successful. And now with one week's perspective behind the events, the Critical Mass arrests were wong but the collective whining about it is just arrogant and trite.
As Sean points out, hundreds of Russian children are dead for no real valid reason. Did one fucking protestor go to the Russian embassy or the U.N. to march for them in the past few days? I'm sure that possibly ONE person did that, but in the big picture the biggest event in NYC seems to not be just the RNC but photo bloggers spending inordinate amounts of time doing redundant work to cover the same event.
As much as I think bloggers can be good, I'm a bit sickened at the "We must do what the Jones" sheep-herd mentality of most NYC bloggers and elsewhere.
I'm sorry Critical Mass riders were arrested. But in the big picture they were never treated as bad as people at Gunatanamo; calling it "Guantanamo on the Hudson" is an insult. And if you decide to protest in a high tension environment, prepare to get arrested.
You had to sleep in your own clothes and were denied food that was acceptable to your taste for 24 hours? Who cares! Real people and real lives are gone. In Sudan. In Russia. In Iraq. I could care less about the collective whining of spoiled yuppie brats.
Sean: It's a nasty bit of calculus to foreground such relatively innocuous violations, but I think the point is if we are willing to accept unconstitutional detention under less than appropriate circumstances (holding someone for 48 hours in a garage that was never intended to house people, without a subsequent criminal charge sounds, well, like kidnapping to me), then we will be even more blase about things in Darfur (I don't remember Zell Miller getting worked up about it either). One very difficult assertion to make in what potentially oppressive (or, rather, on the leading edge of opperssive times) times in the correctly identifying and combating incremental advances towards totalitarianism. If you say something like 'see, this is how fasicm started' you get called a Nazi-baiter. And then those same people turn around after-the-fact and say, well, why did you just stand there and let it happen?
Dazzle: you got arrested with Danny Glover? It heartens me to think that at least one other person wasn't as provinical as all those navel gazing New Yorkers who spent all day on that self indulgent march on Sunday.
I didn't realise that I would kick off such a mini debate such as this. I think its right to say that 24hrs enjoying the hospitality of the Mayor of New York is much worse than being a guest of Dr Rumsfield a man well known for his casual concerns for human rights in more than just Iraqi prisons. Don't forget this guy visited Saddam in the late 80's and shook his hand! Anyway, the sun is setting across London town. I hope everyone in NYC has a great weekend and hopes that Bill Clinton pulls through his heart problems.
Ooops, typo. I meant to say not as bad as being a guest of the good Dr. Apologies to one and all.
"you got arrested with Danny Glover?"
No, but glad you brought him up. When Danny Glover was arrested in Washington during the Sudan protest I know one thing he did not do that the NYC Critical Mass riders did.
He did not whine and cry and bitch and moan like a bunch of petulant babies. He was proud about what he did.
You can learn a few things from him and other protestors who actually have spines.
Dazzle, why do you stick to that 24-hour number? One of the big problems was that the city was defying a judge and previous court decisions to keep protestors much longer, without much of an excuse for why it was taking so long. It's not hard to find stories about this in the media.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/03/politics/campaign/03detain.html?pagewanted=print&position=
http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000103&sid=a3hQlimVb44s&refer=us
Some were held over 48 hours, and there are some reports of 60+ hours.
It's going to cost the city a fortune to settle all of those suits.
That's the difference. Very few people would sue over here. We might speak something close to the same language, but culture? No siree. Sean
the problem is not that people who engaged in civil disobedience were arrested---we can al agree that arrest is pretty much inherent in CD, the problem is for the state to grab up innocent people and then hold them along withthe the cd-ers for an illegal amount of time in unlawful conditions is NOT ok, even if someone somewhere is being held in much worse conditions somewhere else.
as for people in sunday's march being self-indulgent--are you talking about a hundred or so flamboyant souls who disagree w/ the bush agenda and also are highly theatrical and so treateed the march as a chance for them to parade around in silly out fits? well, there were at least 100,000 other people there dressed in shorts and t-shirst carrying signs calling for an end to the horrible war on iraq, calling for attention to the abu graib torture, calling for our country's money to go toward humantarian causes rather than bombs, calling for attention to the AIDS crisis. It was hot as heck, ther was no shade unless you chose to walk on the side walk, and it took me over 2 hours to travel 12 blocks in that crowd. I was marching with my marine's sister against bush sign b/c my brother couldn't make it to NYC for the march, but was there in spirit and was glued to CSPAN and heartened to see that all these people came out to say no to the bush agenda. That was the least I could do (on top of the money and time i donate to humanitarian causes and the work I do full time with homeless NYers)but it wasn't self indulgent. The ice cream from emack i had afterward--now that was self indulgent.
I took over 150 pictures during the RNC protests and I will be posting them on my website (along with stories) over the next few weeks. Why Are We Back In Iraq?
I took quite a few pictures myself; unfortunately, my camera is currently in the NYPD's possession and I'm not hopeful for its safe return. My account is at http://static-ephemera.net/