April 26, 2007
Teachers Getting Paid to Sit Around And Do Nothing
With the recent agreement the city made with the public school principals' union in the news for it's unusual additions (like a $25,000 incentive for principals to head schools in difficult areas), we suggest you also read the Village Voice article about teachers in "rubber rooms" for the underbelly of the public school dealings. The "rubber rooms" are where teachers who are in the middle of disputes, whether they've been rightly or unfairly removed from teaching duties.
One teacher, Georgia Argyis, who was asked to sign a document that accused her to pulling a kindergartener's arm - and then Argyis yelled at the principal and made remarks about her weight, said that being the rubber room was "like being a vegetable."
Rubber room hours match that of a typical school day—Argyris would sign in at 8:30 a.m. and be released at 3:20 in the afternoon, with a 50-minute lunch break. Like something out of a dystopian fairy tale, however, this school had no children, just a few cafeteria workers, social workers, and custodians who shared the same lot...Another teacher told the Voice, "It's high school on steroids. Or maybe a mixture between a minimum security prison and a senior home." And the teachers are getting paid all during this time.Because teachers in rubber rooms are awaiting their cases to be heard, they aren't technically being punished. But they are restricted from numerous activities—they can't use MP3 players, telephones, or laptop computers. (Most flout those rules, however, and use various devices openly.)...
To keep occupied, teachers read, play games like Scrabble or chess, or work on their screenplays. Art teachers work on paintings. Masters degrees get completed. Last year at the Seventh Avenue rubber room, a group of teachers taught each other to knit. Exercise is a popular activity.
And last fall, John Stossel had an "epic" explanation of the bureaucracy that occurs when trying to fire a teacher. See the two page PDF, which explains that the teacher has to sign a document, it doesn't necessarily mean the teacher agrees he/she did anything wrong, it seems more like an acknowledgment the teacher knows what's going on.
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What a choice -- kill myself over decades attempting to teach to lowly animals who barely deserve the chance they're getting; or game the system after getting my tenure: commit some petty bulletproof offense -- a charge that'll never stick -- then check into a room at Livingston Street with my sack full of toys and get paid to do whatever the f**k I want for six hours. My case will be stayed, delayed and appealed till kingdom -- or the graduate degree for my next career -- come.
I should have followed my instincts and become a teacher. But I've never been enough of a grifter to see all the angles.
Bottom line is that no union can protect an employee from firing if management has documented the teacher's misdeeds. All of this is just so much whining about the fact that management has to meet standards in order to fire somebody. Of course management would like to be Donald Trump and fire at will, on a whim, whenever. By the way, all of this was negotiated between the fully grown adults on both sides of the table. John Stossel is a right wing demagogue aand you're a pathertic dupe if you believe anything he says. Give me a break!!!
Bottom line is that no union can protect an employee from firing if management has documented the teacher's misdeeds. All of this is just so much whining about the fact that management has to meet standards in order to fire somebody. Of course management would like to be Donald Trump and fire at will, on a whim, whenever. By the way, all of this was negotiated between the fully grown adults on both sides of the table. John Stossel is a right wing demagogue and you're a pathertic dupe if you believe anything he says. Give me a break!!!
Oh and Kotter (3:56) when you say "lowly animals who barely deserve the chance they're getting" do you know that you sound a tad racist?
Bottom line is that no union can protect an employee from firing if management has documented the teacher's misdeeds. All of this is just so much whining about the fact that management has to meet standards in order to fire somebody. Of course management would like to be Donald Trump and fire at will, on a whim, whenever. By the way, all of this was negotiated between the fully grown adults on both sides of the table. John Stossel is a right wing demagogue and you're a pathertic dupe if you believe anything he says. Give me a break!!!
Oh and Kotter (3:56) when you say "lowly animals who barely deserve the chance they're getting" do you know that you sound a tad racist? Glad you're not a teacher.
This is no surprise to any NYC teacher, but in no way does this represent the majority of teachers out there. In response to Kotter's comments, the vast majority of teachers don't go into teaching to exploit all the "angles"; they do it because they want to give back to society and deeply believe in the work that they do and in the potential of their students. Like any career or industry, there is mismanagement, slackers, grifters, and criminals in public education as well, but in no way do these rubber room inmates represent the whole.
And two more things to consider - the labyrinth that principals have to go through to fire a teacher are there to protect the innocent, not the guilty, much like our court and legal system. Don't judge it until you've been involved in it and are fighting for your livelihood and reputation against some false allegation. Secondly, if teaching is such a cushy job, then how come people aren't beating down the doors to teach in NYC public schools? Are you willing to quit what you do for a living and become a NYC teacher? I'm sure most of you will respond with a resounding "Hell no!" So there you have it.
Stossel is an idiot. He has a few valid points, but he slathers his arguments in such an anti-teacher, pro-free market agenda that he is instantly discredited.
Look, bad teachers should be weeded out of the system in a much easier and efficient way. But when teachers have a difficult job keeping increasingly disrespectful and inattentive kids in line--let alone teach them--and then have to deal with angry parents whose little darlings can do no wrong and feel teachers are responsible for everything (hmm, maybe they can sit down and make sure they do their homework or aren't jerks in school), you have to have some system set up to make sure the accusations of those bratty kids and unreasonable parents are accurate. Don't get me wrong, lord knows there are enough bad teachers out there.
This is what tenure is supposed to do, weed out ineffective teachers. They need to do a better job of evaluating teachers before they become tenured, and then make a better plan for getting rid of bad teachers once they are tenured. Nobody disagrees with that. Let's just not get hysterical about teachers because a few are morons.
I wish my company had a "rubber room" for recalcitrant employees. Right now all they are offering is unemployment.
this is why democracy just won't work
I'll have unmitigated respect for unions when they start protecting those who really deserve it and stop sheltering the (hopefully small) segment of their membership dragging everyone else down.
The unions don't want public or private sector management to have power to fire or discipline at will? Fine. An alternative solution: leave those decisions up to the members of the union. I trust a large group of teachers to know who is a good teacher and who is not. Put teachers in the teacher's union up for anonymous review by their peers every x number of years. Problem solved.
What's so bad about arbitrary firing of people? Let's say you have a terrible school boss and s/he's just firing teachers left and right for all sorts of arbitrary non-reasons. If principals could be fired too, don't you think the bad principal would be fired in due time? My daughter's private school doesn't offer teachers tenure. A teacher was recently shown the door after some complaints from parents and kids. Without going into too much detail, the teacher didn't seem to be all that interested in the job. And now she's gone. She's young so she got a warning but after a few weeks of probation, boom, she was out. And a new teacher took her place. Onward and upward for my daugther's fancy pre-school. The bad apple? She'll probably end up teaching public school kids and being a crummy teacher for decades. Is this such an abusive system. I've worked as an at will employee (in marketing) for years and worked with my share of incompetent employers. The fact that I can be fired for my hair color or choice of shoes doesn't bother me. Fact is, I've been laid off a few times and managed to get better jobs without too much trouble in the same city afterwards. Why can't teachers play by these rules? I'm not saying tenure doesn't make sense for college professors. I think it does. And supreme court justices. But why do people teaching third graders think that tenure is a god given right? And why do unions insist on NO merit pay for a star teachers? If a truly good teacher is fired for a bad reason in time land they'll land on their feet like the talented people who get laid off all the time in other professions.
What's so bad about arbitrary firing of people? Let's say you have a terrible school boss and s/he's just firing teachers left and right for all sorts of arbitrary non-reasons. If principals could be fired too, don't you think the bad principal would be fired in due time? My daughter's private school doesn't offer teachers tenure. A teacher was recently shown the door after some complaints from parents and kids. Without going into too much detail, the teacher didn't seem to be all that interested in the job. And now she's gone. She's young so she got a warning but after a few weeks of probation, boom, she was out. And a new teacher took her place. Onward and upward for my daugther's fancy pre-school. The bad apple? She'll probably end up teaching public school kids and being a crummy teacher for decades. Is this such an abusive system. I've worked as an at will employee (in marketing) for years and worked with my share of incompetent employers. The fact that I can be fired for my hair color or choice of shoes doesn't bother me. Fact is, I've been laid off a few times and managed to get better jobs without too much trouble in the same city afterwards. Why can't teachers play by these rules? I'm not saying tenure doesn't make sense for college professors. I think it does. And supreme court justices. But why do people teaching third graders think that tenure is a god given right? And why do unions insist on NO merit pay for a star teachers? If a truly good teacher is fired for a bad reason in time land they'll land on their feet like the talented people who get laid off all the time in other professions.
You can find the blog of a teacher who's been in the rubber room for almost a year now at life-in-the-rubber-room [dot] blogspot [dot] com.
It's totally terrifying how long he was there before anyone told him why, and how terrible the terms he's being offered to get out are.
The deal with tenure, and why I wouldn't have such a problem with it were it implemented properly, is that it does protect older teachers who have been slaving away in the system for decades, who may have over time gotten themselves to a half-decent pay grade.
If we 'corporatize' our educational system, a teacher would be axed once he/she reached a certain salary level or a certain age. I personally think that educators require time to mature their teaching style and on top of that - let's face it - it's not an easy career path. If you haven't spent much time in front of a group of children or young adults for days at a time, I can assure you it's a far cry from sitting in a cubicle and dealing with nosy admins or endless and soul-sucking conference calls.
My point being that we should incentivize teachers to think of their career as a long-term endeavor and not just a 3-year jaunt until something else pans out. Providing tenure - even though in theory I hate tenure - sends the message that we do want them in this for the long haul, and that on our end we're willing to protect their interests over that long haul. I think that's a fair trade-off.
The price you pay in the private sector for more mobility and higher pay is less protection. That makes sense to me.
If someone could explain to me management severence packages...now THAT is an institution that has no place in this world.
With the recent agreement the city made with the public school principals' union in the news for it's unusual additions (like a $25,000 incentive for principals to head schools in difficult areas), we suggest you also read the Village Voice article about teachers in "rubber rooms" for the underbelly of the public school dealings. The "rubber rooms" are where teachers who are in the middle of disputes ARE PLACED?, whether they've been rightly or unfairly removed from teaching duties.
One teacher, Georgia Argyis, who was asked to sign a document that accused her to pulling a kindergartener's arm - and then Argyis yelled at the principal and made remarks about her weight, said that being IN? the rubber room was "like being a vegetable."
I'd just like to point out that Terry Colon is the man!
Isn't it a bit unnecessary to offer tenure to high school teachers? It's not like these people are doing research or breaking new ground in academics. They're relied upon to provide students with a base of education in classic subjects.
All I know is this:
A teacher at my high school threw a desk in a room full of students in a rage. The teacher was not fired.
A teacher in my school district was caught drinking while driving...on her way to work... and was not fired.
I think that the protection that unions offer teachers from being fired are too strong. It's one thing to protect teachers from being fired unfairly, but it's another to make it impossible to fire a teacher that needs to be fired.
The teacher's union here is unbelievable. No wonder so many public schools in NYC do a woefully inadequate job! Bring back the paddle in elementary and middle school and protect schools from being sued by irate parents! When the rest of the class hear the sound of that paddle as it hits someone's rear, it will scare them into discipline.